tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post5311375102730348063..comments2023-10-22T09:18:16.885-04:00Comments on Far and Wide: AmenSteve Vhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comBlogger27125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-6466140709551297552008-11-22T08:34:00.000-05:002008-11-22T08:34:00.000-05:00"Indeed, they campaigned in the last election defe..."Indeed, they campaigned in the last election defending a corporate tax cut regime that will cost the federal treasury billions over the next few years, while continuing to shift the tax burden disproportionately onto the shoulders of ordinary Canadians."<BR/><BR/>Oh, yes, and pompous windbag, can you tell me what is missing from this sentence? Not sure "they" cuts it, but you're the expert. Too funny.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-65090545309028449572008-11-22T08:27:00.000-05:002008-11-22T08:27:00.000-05:00No, I'm good thanks.No, I'm good thanks.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-11588305061112570702008-11-22T02:34:00.000-05:002008-11-22T02:34:00.000-05:00Steve V wrote this:The most hilarious part, you're...Steve V wrote this:<BR/><BR/><I>The most hilarious part, you're effectively sanctioning the same posturing, completely devoid of the purist principles that supposedly set the NDP apart.</I><BR/><BR/>This is but one of several sentences that are literally unintelligible to speakers and readers of the English language.<BR/><BR/>Would you like to re-phrase, taking due care to observe the rules of English grammar and punctuation?Stephenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13948813957907216580noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-89724202126810526392008-11-21T23:22:00.000-05:002008-11-21T23:22:00.000-05:00"I think the Liberals have a bad case of "penis en..."I think the Liberals have a bad case of "penis envy". They look at the NDP and the BQ boldly rejecting Harper while they are stuck propping him up and they wish they could do the same - but they can't."<BR/><BR/>I think you have "brain tissue envy".Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-87544759219006753752008-11-21T23:07:00.000-05:002008-11-21T23:07:00.000-05:00StephenYou're point is nothing more than a dodge a...Stephen<BR/><BR/>You're point is nothing more than a dodge and weave, that introduces past action to justify current contradiction.<BR/><BR/>Hey apologists, can someone please reconcile Jack's rhetoric of the past two months with this display today. The most hilarious part, you're effectively sanctioning the same posturing, completely devoid of the purist principles that supposedly set the NDP apart. Layton is acting like a opportunistic hack, nothing more, nothing less. What you miss here, what the blinders can't see, the NDP are exactly what they claim to detest, and in this instance, they are revealed in a pretty profound way. The only reason people can still cling to the ideal, is because the decision making is always within the theoretical, it can operate under different rules than parties that actually have practical realities. I'm afraid Layton's gambit here, is nothing more than admission of marginal importance. I mean, watch what happens when the NDP votes against, NOTHING. And, this is why we can ascribe pedestals to used car salesman.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-20550853895994571682008-11-21T22:49:00.000-05:002008-11-21T22:49:00.000-05:00Steve VExcuse me, but are we talking about budgets...Steve V<BR/><BR/><I>Excuse me, but are we talking about budgets here?? If this was a vote on substance, after a few months of sitting, then you might have a point. We are talking about a throne speech, FIVE weeks after an election</I><BR/><BR/>Exactly, like I said in my post, Throne Speeches and votes on them are symbolic, not substantive.<BR/><BR/>The same people you are now calling "adults" and "serious" for a vote that is nothing more than a gesture are the same people who, eight months ago, did serious harm to the country by supporting a Harper budget that has helped to wreck the fiscal framework for the company.<BR/><BR/>Indeed, they campaigned in the last election defending a corporate tax cut regime that will cost the federal treasury billions over the next few years, while continuing to shift the tax burden disproportionately onto the shoulders of ordinary Canadians.<BR/><BR/>Yet these same people, having done such harm on substantive votes that actually counted, receive your praise as "adult" and "serious" for giving Harper a pass on a speech you yourself call "meaningless symbolism."<BR/><BR/>With all due respect, I'm not the one running the risk of not having a point.Stephenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13948813957907216580noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-15241383896504954592008-11-21T20:48:00.000-05:002008-11-21T20:48:00.000-05:00I think the Liberals have a bad case of "penis env...I think the Liberals have a bad case of "penis envy". They look at the NDP and the BQ boldly rejecting Harper while they are stuck propping him up and they wish they could do the same - but they can't.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-506639617997948932008-11-21T20:29:00.000-05:002008-11-21T20:29:00.000-05:00Actually, no, Steve, it's not "the same as endorsi...Actually, no, Steve, it's not "the same as endorsing another election." Defeating this flaccid Throne Speech would likely lead to the GG inviting Mr. Dion to find Parliament's support for an alternate agenda. The Liberals are choosing to forgo that opportunity and rubber-stamp Harper's regime instead. Again.<BR/><BR/>Not one month ago, Steve, you were <A HREF="http://farnwide.blogspot.com/2008/10/abstaining.html" REL="nofollow">boldy calling</A> for the rubber-stamp to be tossed overboard. For lines to be drawn in the sand. For principles to be upheld. <BR/><BR/>What changed?<BR/><BR/>P.S. Where on earth do you find Layton calling the election "unnecessary"?Jaytoohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01027122148435844420noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-33615504201143776592008-11-21T19:26:00.000-05:002008-11-21T19:26:00.000-05:00anonIt's not a majority, and a vote against is the...anon<BR/><BR/>It's not a majority, and a vote against is the same as endorsing another election. The NDP are just hiding behind the adults, so we "never hear the end of it" about the Libs propping up the government.<BR/><BR/>Look, people can spin it until we're dizzy, but nobody seems to want to deal with the contradictions I've presented, based on Layton's OWN WORDS.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-63929406437556937792008-11-21T19:23:00.000-05:002008-11-21T19:23:00.000-05:00re: Layton's respone: Big hat, no cattle.re: Layton's respone: Big hat, no cattle.Blues Clairhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08053624911945551511noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-48625731422131711592008-11-21T19:21:00.000-05:002008-11-21T19:21:00.000-05:00It is quite normal for opposition parties to vote ...It is quite normal for opposition parties to vote against Throne speeches. In fact when there is a majority government it is a no-brainer that all opposition parties vote NO to a throne speech.<BR/><BR/>If the Liberals really think that the NDP and the BQ (remember them?) are just grandstanding and are only voting NO because they know that the Liberals will cave - then why doesn't the Liberal Party call the NDP's bluff and announce it will vote NO and see what the NDP or BQ do?<BR/><BR/>BTW: Let's face it - if the NDP voted with the Conservatives one single solitary time - we would never hear the end of it from you Liberals about how "the NDP is propping up Harper" etc...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-84711822568177657212008-11-21T19:15:00.000-05:002008-11-21T19:15:00.000-05:00"Unfortunately, the Libs are again failing in that..."Unfortunately, the Libs are again failing in that task"<BR/><BR/>How anyone can draw that conclusion from a throne speech verdict escapes me.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-37834468441713646212008-11-21T19:04:00.000-05:002008-11-21T19:04:00.000-05:00Steve: I'd argue that "getting down to business" i...Steve: I'd argue that "getting down to business" in a minority Parliament includes making clear to the government that it needs to work with the other parties - highlighting both one's own leverage and a willingness to use it in the public interest. And that includes clearly drawing lines as to what kind of policies won't earn one's support.<BR/><BR/>Unfortunately, the Libs are again failing in that task - and all opposition parties will have a tougher time trying to influence the Cons' direction as a result.Greg Fingashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01506686081291502115noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-85782285339413357092008-11-21T18:58:00.000-05:002008-11-21T18:58:00.000-05:00That's my trump card :)That's my trump card :)Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-65393110146733066242008-11-21T17:36:00.000-05:002008-11-21T17:36:00.000-05:00LOL .. Touche! ;)LOL .. Touche! ;)leftdoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06936887870919391739noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-3148385796761338032008-11-21T17:31:00.000-05:002008-11-21T17:31:00.000-05:00"By the way, has the Liberal party paid back all o..."By the way, has the Liberal party paid back all of the money from the Adscam scandal to the taxpayers yet?"<BR/><BR/>Wow, if that isn't an indication of a lame retort, not sure what would be. Oh, and btw, I voted for your party during that period :)Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-2192516408734360432008-11-21T17:23:00.000-05:002008-11-21T17:23:00.000-05:00Riley's criticism is totally lame. Far & W...Riley's criticism is totally lame. Far & Wide's endorsement of it is lamer still!<BR/><BR/>Layton and the New Democrats are the only opposition party that has ACTUALLY BEEN 'opposition' to Harper! New Democrats do not need to be lectured to by Liberals!! (By the way, has the Liberal party paid back all of the money from the Adscam scandal to the taxpayers yet?)leftdoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06936887870919391739noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-25599574286368646082008-11-21T16:07:00.000-05:002008-11-21T16:07:00.000-05:00stephenExcuse me, but are we talking about budgets...stephen<BR/><BR/>Excuse me, but are we talking about budgets here?? If this was a vote on substance, after a few months of sitting, then you might have a point. We are talking about a throne speech, FIVE weeks after an election, so yes let's get "serious" for a brief second, before we return to the partisan nonsense. Weak.<BR/><BR/>jurist<BR/><BR/>I'm sure we would both agree that posturing will rear it's head at some point, that's the nature of the beast. However, it's kind of rich, to come off an election, wherein you argued it was unnecessary, then upon return, express a desire to get down to business, followed by voting against an initial throne speech. If you can reconcile these contradictions, I'm impressed, because I can't.<BR/><BR/>gayle<BR/><BR/>Interesting indeed, thanks :)Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-15984290165634774672008-11-21T15:52:00.000-05:002008-11-21T15:52:00.000-05:00Adults? Serious?I hope you're not talking about t...Adults? Serious?<BR/><BR/>I hope you're not talking about the Liberal party.<BR/><BR/>Throne speeches are symbolic, but budget votes aren't, and when the adult, serious Liberals okayed Stephen Harper's 2008 budget, they helped blow a hole in the nation's finances with irresponsible taxation changes.<BR/><BR/>Check out the Parliamentary Budget Officer's recent report, and you'll read that recent policy changes in-- a number supported by the Liberals in Budget 2008--are largely responsible for the weak fiscal framework we now face in Canada.<BR/><BR/>Now, of course, the real consequences are clear of the plan adult, serious Liberals termed "a watered-down Liberal budget" that was sending Canada broadly in the right direction: clearly bad.<BR/><BR/>And Liberals have the nerve to complain that Stephen Harper is a bad economic manager when they helped him get his most recent management plan through.<BR/><BR/>Adult? Serious? Hardly.<BR/><BR/>Liberal? Absolutely.Stephenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13948813957907216580noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-54743937580309548422008-11-21T15:39:00.001-05:002008-11-21T15:39:00.001-05:00Steve: In considering the credibility of your sour...Steve: In considering the credibility of your source, I'll point to the following from the same column:<BR/><BR/>"Still smarting from last session's repeat humiliations, Liberals vow they will no longer routinely support the government on confidence measures to avoid an election. Not that they will be provocative; they are pre-occupied, after all, with their leadership race. But if they are going to choose their battles, they better make sure they get to the microphones before Layton -- and put the onus on him, for a change."<BR/><BR/>So Riley outright encourages exactly the same thing she criticizes Layton for doing - so long as it works to the Libs' advantage rather than the NDP's. Which should offer a fairly strong hint as to how honest and reasonable her attempt to critique Layton really is.Greg Fingashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01506686081291502115noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-33416882537026071212008-11-21T15:39:00.000-05:002008-11-21T15:39:00.000-05:00I saw a part of a clip (I think on CBC) during the...I saw a part of a clip (I think on CBC) during the beginning of the election campaign. The words in the speech were almost exactly the same words Layton uses in his speech. It was a speech by David Lewis, NDP leader - in "1972".<BR/><BR/>Hey, Jack, try some of your own thoughts and get in the 21st century.<BR/><BR/>If Jack was so concerned about the working Canadians - he'd be totally against spending another $300 million for an election just over 35 days from the last election and put that money to better use.<BR/><BR/>Layton is a joke. Give him a mirror and a camera and the little boy will be happy for a while. Don't you just love the OVER exaggerated "stern" look he has when he's in the House. Unbelievable.RuralSandihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09552973218865121867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-20870682924051706352008-11-21T14:37:00.000-05:002008-11-21T14:37:00.000-05:00Slightly off topic Steve, but I thought you might ...Slightly off topic Steve, but I thought you might find this interesting:<BR/><BR/>http://www.canada.com/edmontonjournal/news/opinion/story.html?id=16086645-5520-4a97-8ca4-8ce26a87720dGaylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08112657859825911939noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-63502608214778144622008-11-21T14:28:00.000-05:002008-11-21T14:28:00.000-05:00It will be most interesting how Layton reactes the...It will be most interesting how Layton reactes the first time the Liberals announce they are voting against a bill and the NDP finds itself holding the balance of power and a forced election in their own hands. If he struts he will commit suicide.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-4376841675769075862008-11-21T14:15:00.000-05:002008-11-21T14:15:00.000-05:00Yes, it's time for another election! Let Layton be...Yes, it's time for another election! Let Layton become PM, and watch him pay for everything with his promised job-killing hike in corporate taxes!<BR/><BR/>[From corps not making any money...]<BR/><BR/>And heck, having another election is only going to cost taxpayers another $300 million.<BR/><BR/>Layton, yet again, is being daring and brave while doing little more than armchair quarterbacking.<BR/><BR/>Yes, great principles at work there.Mark Richard Francishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16331995640397477486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-47175618469799702992008-11-21T14:07:00.000-05:002008-11-21T14:07:00.000-05:00"I am proud that my party didn't."Of course you ar..."I am proud that my party didn't."<BR/><BR/>Of course you are. Off to the polls!Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.com