tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post8251380889952964184..comments2023-10-22T09:18:16.885-04:00Comments on Far and Wide: Liberals Need To Take A StandSteve Vhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-50911677630483277722008-11-27T16:14:00.000-05:002008-11-27T16:14:00.000-05:00According to the media, the Liberals will NOT supp...According to the media, the Liberals will NOT support economic statement!Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-2856547978843521452008-11-27T15:54:00.000-05:002008-11-27T15:54:00.000-05:00I just saw a NDP MP and Liberal MP openly discussi...I just saw a NDP MP and Liberal MP openly discussing a coalition government as a possibility. The NDP seem eager, the Liberal "were not quite there yet", but "it's happened before". VERY interesting days ahead.<BR/><BR/><BR/>ben<BR/><BR/>If it was phased in, then I'd agree it could be a good thing. That said, fundraising is already a critical discussion within the party, so it's not like Harper's gambit is a wakeup call.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-56259836129580558732008-11-27T15:51:00.000-05:002008-11-27T15:51:00.000-05:00Although I agree this move is underhanded, unfair,...Although I agree this move is underhanded, unfair, undemocratic etc (though not uncommon and agree with Cynic, not isolated) let me play devil's advocate for a sec and reveal a possible silver lining:<BR/><BR/>If the numbers I just saw are correct, the LPC relies on public financing for 67% of its revenue. That's insane. This move will force the Party to change, NOW. Meanwhile, you can more or less sit back and watch the uncontrollable economy take its toll on this unprepared and horribly underqualified government, nailing them on each mistake as they happen. In the end, you will have remade your party's fundraising structure and will face a Conservative party that is bruised and battered, leading you to a breezy election win sometime in late 2010 or so, just around the time when the economy will be picking up. Then as you take the reigns of power, the slowly rising economy is credited to your sober leadership which lasts far into the 21st century. Eh?CuzBenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14169446711811834115noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-67843748008274547012008-11-27T15:25:00.000-05:002008-11-27T15:25:00.000-05:00I don't think it is a stretch to suggest that this...I don't think it is a stretch to suggest that this is democracy itself on trial. The LPC needs to put their internecine squabbles aside and call Harper's bluff on this one.<BR/><BR/>One question I have: since the LPC leadership race is between essentially two candidates, why can't caucus just decide and save more wasted time and money,not to mention dissention?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-65887065196987105042008-11-27T13:20:00.000-05:002008-11-27T13:20:00.000-05:00The Conservative party is the largest beneficiary...The Conservative party is the largest beneficiary of the political tax credit, which sees donations to political parties reimbursed at least 50% using public money. I don't see Flaherty suggesting that that huge subsidy be revoked. Far from being hit the hardest, the Conservative Party will be the best situated party if this change goes through.<BR/><BR/>Furthermore, campaign expenses at the riding level are also routinely reimbursed for the larger parties with public money.<BR/><BR/>If the Conservatives really were that concerned about our money, they wouldn't have wasted $300 million on a useless election.Mark Richard Francishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16331995640397477486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-15358268398829144432008-11-27T12:35:00.000-05:002008-11-27T12:35:00.000-05:00Also interesting - Harper and his wife Loreen have...Also interesting - Harper and his wife Loreen have become quite close friends with GG (even though Harper didn't like it when she was appointed). I think it was Jane Taber (don't hold me to that) that said that Loreen and GG do nature walks together and stuff.<BR/><BR/>Do you not see a pattern with Harper? He befriended Charest when he needed him, that was two-faced and befriended Dumont, etc., etc.<BR/><BR/>Do you think GG would go against Harper's wishes?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-86867954314540366582008-11-27T12:16:00.000-05:002008-11-27T12:16:00.000-05:00Interesting.<A HREF="http://bigcitylib.blogspot.com/2008/11/somewhat-credible-rumour.html" REL="nofollow">Interesting</A>.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-91421195564587162382008-11-27T11:26:00.000-05:002008-11-27T11:26:00.000-05:00Principled Steve is back. Welcome!Scott T: Bingo. ...Principled Steve is back. Welcome!<BR/><BR/>Scott T: Bingo. That "open musing" about options for an alternative government should have started immediately post-election. But if your guys needed this attack on public election financing as a spark, okay. Just no more turtling from here on, k?Jaytoohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01027122148435844420noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-31594105426235807482008-11-27T11:14:00.000-05:002008-11-27T11:14:00.000-05:00Agree with those saying Liberals, NDP and Bloc sho...Agree with those saying Liberals, NDP and Bloc should vote it down and go to GG to propose forming new government.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-77794928855573722982008-11-27T11:11:00.000-05:002008-11-27T11:11:00.000-05:00You're from Ontario Steve. I don't remember readin...You're from Ontario Steve. I don't remember reading such outrage when the McG Liberals changed the parliamentary hours, stifled debates, time allocated controversial bills, engaged in overtly partisan debates on the economy, reduced salaries for opposition researchers while bolstering their own etc etc etc etc. <BR/><BR/>"we're not talking about Ontario" you will say. I say you should be because it shows that anti-democratic bullying is nothing new and not a conservative phenom. Sad but true.<BR/><BR/>But oh wait, nobody gives a shit about Ontario politics despite the $100 billion they control. <BR/><BR/>Dalton and Harper = peas in a pod.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-27967548735719533982008-11-27T10:54:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:54:00.000-05:00Well put as usual Steve. I agree completely that ...Well put as usual Steve. I agree completely that the Liberals should take a stand. Harper reminds me of Fagin in Oliver Twist, I call him Stevie one-note because all he can do is obsess about the Liberals while the country and the planet go down the tubes.Susanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12925229206558848754noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-72650234853758125802008-11-27T10:53:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:53:00.000-05:00The opposition parties should now be openly musing...The opposition parties should now be openly musing to the press that the G.G can ask other parties in the House to try and form a government rather then waste another 300 million $ on another unnecessary election a month and a half after the last unnecessary election fuelled by Harper's determination to get a majority before the economic meltdown hit.<BR/><BR/>Such open talk of this scenario may get him to back off (and it certainly is a strong possibility of happening as well).Oxford County Liberalshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12181314055142726735noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-24638637374907576132008-11-27T10:44:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:44:00.000-05:00"Haha, attack on democracy. Political parties fund..."Haha, attack on democracy. Political parties funding themselves through voluntary donations: tyranny!!!"<BR/><BR/>When this is done without notice, in a manner that will cut the legs out from under all the opposition parties, then yes, it is an attack on democracy.<BR/><BR/>Not that I think Harper will go through with it. He just wants to be able to point his finger at the opposition, say "ha ha" while he continues to take in his taxpayer funded democracy.<BR/><BR/>Unless, of course, he is willing to put his money where his mouth is and voluntarily give up his subsidy when the measure is voted down.Gaylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08112657859825911939noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-83196128232430329462008-11-27T10:43:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:43:00.000-05:00Ah, the rational musing of a Blogging Tory. Yes, ...Ah, the rational musing of a Blogging Tory. Yes, laughable.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-13880430381749385792008-11-27T10:39:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:39:00.000-05:00Oh Steve of little faith...This issue isn't even r...Oh Steve of little faith...<BR/><BR/>This issue isn't even registering with voters who are more concerned with, gasp, "KEEPING THEY'RE EFFING JOBS" as opposed to $30 million going to a bunch of partisan hacks who spend more time attacking each other than actually contributing to solving the problems of voters.<BR/><BR/>I am loving this, though. Go ahead, bring the government down. We're going into deficit anyway, what's another $350 million and political instability at a time of economic crisis anyway.<BR/><BR/>If the liberals are so concerned about funding, how about changing those ARCANE rules that allow the party to choose its leaders. Why not get into the 21st century and do "one member, one vote."<BR/><BR/>Very simply, Canadians don't give a damn about the plight of politicians in this country. God knows, they've got problems enough of their own.<BR/><BR/>In closing, Liberals MUST know they are being played here, right? Harper is drumming up opposition outrage to drown out any concerns about the prospect of Canada going into a deficit.<BR/><BR/>Dalton went $500 million into deficit and simultaneously announced a ban on cellphone use while driving... this is all about deflection and distraction. That Liberals are falling for it is freaking laughable.Sean Cummingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01550744638377851070noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-5976909355288470142008-11-27T10:30:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:30:00.000-05:00Yes, I think people are missing the point here, a ...Yes, I think people are missing the point here, a vote against doesn't mean another election. There is a very plausible scenario where the majority of MP's ask the GG to form a government, this lot of opportunists have shown themselves, nobody wants another election.<BR/><BR/>It's a minority people!Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-28725594838453452262008-11-27T10:27:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:27:00.000-05:00If an election is the final result, there will be ...If an election is the final result, there will be more than enough ammunition due to the Cons inaction with regards stimulus.<BR/><BR/>Bring them down. Go to the Governor General.Constant Vigilancehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03839753866104400007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-11393648426623403872008-11-27T10:26:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:26:00.000-05:00Hahahaha. That's so stupid it really gave me a goo...Hahahaha. That's so stupid it really gave me a good laugh. Thanks Gene.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-59026328144059932372008-11-27T10:25:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:25:00.000-05:00eugeneWow, that's some sad spin. This initiative ...eugene<BR/><BR/>Wow, that's some sad spin. This initiative is good for Canadian unity.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-66584946743960383972008-11-27T10:24:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:24:00.000-05:00I can't believe the Liberals would want to support...I can't believe the Liberals would want to support maintaining the Bloc's taxpayer funding!Eugenehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10449818999808881910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-76265612235960646132008-11-27T10:21:00.001-05:002008-11-27T10:21:00.001-05:00I agree that the opposition should vote this down....I agree that the opposition should vote this down. But, needless to say it will look pretty bad on the Liberals that they were willing to prop up the Tories for over a year - as long as they were doing stuff that was destructive to Canada as a whole - but now they suddenly want to play hardball when its something that affects the Liberal Party.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-21432204457828760202008-11-27T10:21:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:21:00.000-05:00If the Liberals, NDs, Bloquistes, and Greens of th...If the Liberals, NDs, Bloquistes, and Greens of this country are so incensed by this 'outrage' I'm sure they'll step up to the plate and donate a toonie each every year in order to make up the shortfall to their respective parties. There's more heat than light appearing on the left horizon. I think they do protest too much!<BR/><BR/>jvpJohn van Poptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06485880836239180333noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-81091851336201590902008-11-27T10:15:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:15:00.000-05:00And, if the Tories don't want another election, th...And, if the Tories don't want another election, then simply remove or amend the irritant, so we can get down to serious issues, rather than cynically exploiting a economic crisis for partisan advantage.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-41429284728092931862008-11-27T10:13:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:13:00.000-05:00grumpyOh, you're still around, hadn't noticed. Ya...grumpy<BR/><BR/>Oh, you're still around, hadn't noticed. Yawn is right.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-69367120966758913642008-11-27T10:03:00.000-05:002008-11-27T10:03:00.000-05:00Newsflash: 15,000 auto workers in Ontario may be s...Newsflash: 15,000 auto workers in Ontario may be shit out of luck my January. The economy is going south faster than you can say "gimme my gold plated MP pension" and I suspect the average voter strongly supports this move by the Tories. You can engage in spin all you want (God knows the Tories are, claiming that "we must all do our part") but if this is an affront to Democracy as many claim, then I will expect Canadians, rightly concerned about the state of their democracy will be calling MP's until the fibre-optic lines melt, DEMANDING the opposition defeat the government so we can spend another $350 million on an election that nobody gives a rat's ass about.<BR/><BR/>The $30 million to political parties is important to political parties and NOT Joe and Suzy citizen. Those 15,000 auto workers would probably like to see a bailout to protect their jobs as opposed to:<BR/><BR/>a) $30 million going to political parties<BR/>b) $350 million for another election<BR/><BR/>Yawn.Sean Cummingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01550744638377851070noreply@blogger.com