tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post9135583521559948322..comments2023-10-22T09:18:16.885-04:00Comments on Far and Wide: Naked PoliticsSteve Vhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-30980379059264406212009-06-08T10:05:45.860-04:002009-06-08T10:05:45.860-04:00What's striking is this:
I'm disappointed...What's striking is this:<br /><br /><i>I'm disappointed in Ignatieff, but if one is being honest here, this "approach" has been present for a few years now, as Liberals continually bend and contort reacting to Conservative wedge politics. </i><br /><br />This sort of thing was routinely blamed on Dion and his "weak leadership", along with his desire to avoid an election. <br /><br />Yet the Liberals are up in the polls now, are jockeying for a fight, and have a leader whose grip on the party is unparalleled since the beginning of the millennium...and <i>still</i> see the same behavior!<br /><br />So what's going on?Demostheneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14552994996411944134noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-12509561185558138672009-06-05T21:08:09.935-04:002009-06-05T21:08:09.935-04:00why do we let regressive crap like C 15 pass?
You...<i>why do we let regressive crap like C 15 pass?</i><br /><br />You know the answer to that question. They don't wish to appear to be soft on crime. Exactly why the "war on drugs" continues, and fails, over and over again, at huge monetary and social expense to all.<br /><br />It's the same reason why we can't discuss changes in the health care system in this country. No-one wants to be accused of promoting US-style health care.Möbiushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11851148006420274055noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-46243744195963637522009-06-05T13:59:25.297-04:002009-06-05T13:59:25.297-04:00Steve:
I see Mr. Janke has gotten on Susan's ...Steve:<br /><br />I see Mr. Janke has gotten on Susan's blogpost and manages to denigrate both the Liberal bloggers who are dissenting against this stance, as well as take cheapshots at Iggy's supposed coup takeover of the LPC, all in the same post.<br /><br />At least he admits he doesnt think his blogpost have any influence on the CPC, which isn't surprising considering he parrots the CPC party line down to the comma.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-12197410033498389052009-06-05T13:28:30.784-04:002009-06-05T13:28:30.784-04:00The Liberals really need to take a stand. They ca...The Liberals really need to take a stand. They can not continue to straddle both sides of political divide. When it comes to marijuana for example their position on possession has been that has been pretty lax since <br />Chretein quipped that he would have a joint in one hand and the money for his fine in other. At the same time, they have been ever more supportive of tougher penalties for drug trafficking . To say that such stances are mutually inconsistent would be an understatement. How can consuming a joint be no worse than speeding and something virtually every Liberal leader can laugh about but passing one worthy of a year in jail. <br /><br />Early this week John Reynolds came out in support heroin maintance. On Sunday Ignatieff gives a talk in West Vancouver, Reynolds old riding. That in nut shell goes to show how out of touch Liberal position is with movers and shakers in Vancouver.Kobyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03407275645274060038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-57491044667568421712009-06-05T13:07:07.687-04:002009-06-05T13:07:07.687-04:00"So long as the only option is get tough on c..."So long as the only option is get tough on crime or stay the course, the Conservatives are going to win the issue. They are the ones that started the discussion and they are always going to be the ones deemed toughest on crime."<br /><br />I guess the question then becomes, if everyone knows this, why do we let regressive crap like C 15 pass?Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-55880525510655441312009-06-05T13:02:09.664-04:002009-06-05T13:02:09.664-04:00The last 5 polls that I have seen on the subject s...The last 5 polls that I have seen on the subject show that a majority of Canada’s support marijuana legalization and by a fairly large margin. More to the point it is something that is particularly popular with the Liberal base. According a 2007 poll, for which the complete breakdown is available, support is 55-41 nationally and is favoured by Liberal supporters 68-29 and by NDP supporters 71 -27. <br />http://angusreidstrategies.com/uploads/pages/pdfs/2007.06.27%20Drugs%20Press%20Release.pdf<br /><br />The way to drum up grassroots support is not pass policies that they are firmly against and then ask them to donate money.<br /><br />As to the political calcuation involved here, it is not one that is going to work for the Liberals. The political advantage the Conservatives get from this is not from their being major differences between the major parties, but from the tone of debate generally. So long as the only option is get tough on crime or stay the course, the Conservatives are going to win the issue. They are the ones that started the discussion and they are always going to be the ones deemed toughest on crime. The only way the crime issue turns around for the Liberals is if they offer an alternative vision. Now I now that I have beaten this issue to death, but if the Liberals were to propose to legalize marijuana, they would catch the Conservatives flat footed.Kobyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03407275645274060038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-55494239210949716082009-06-05T12:49:02.242-04:002009-06-05T12:49:02.242-04:00This is a huge vote loser in Quebec (I seem to rem...This is a huge vote loser in Quebec (I seem to remember an issue in the recent elecction) and BC. They ought think this one out a little more on the Hill.James Curranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08064830948270604331noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-23695462613532660232009-06-05T12:42:59.384-04:002009-06-05T12:42:59.384-04:00"Seriously, do you honestly think they are ju..."Seriously, do you honestly think they are just going to stop on the crime policies? We keep appeasing and they keep taking."<br /><br />No. We can't win here, which is why I called it "misguided". This is a loser every way you look at, and because of that, it makes the principled evaporation all the harder to take. People have convinced themselves that we have to make people in the burbs think the Libs care about grow ops, etc, but it's really selling our soul in the process.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-13642824706637366082009-06-05T12:40:09.101-04:002009-06-05T12:40:09.101-04:00The problem with appeasement is that we have to dr...The problem with appeasement is that we have to draw a line. The Conservatives can go so far down the deep side on crime legislation that they can rip our party unity apart if we stick to appeasement.<br /><br />Seriously, do you honestly think they are just going to stop on the crime policies? We keep appeasing and they keep taking.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-24034170218374760982009-06-05T12:28:49.733-04:002009-06-05T12:28:49.733-04:00Liberal support of C-15 certainly does nothing to ...Liberal support of C-15 certainly does nothing to help woo soft NDP voters who Ignatieff may or may not need in any upcoming election.sjwhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16425560486235905508noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-80789251986146395762009-06-05T12:16:49.780-04:002009-06-05T12:16:49.780-04:00penlan
It is a huge mistake, no question. I'...penlan<br /><br />It is a huge mistake, no question. I'm not sanctioning what we're doing, just some thoughts on why we've allowed ourselves to be complicit. I agree with everything others have argued, completely.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-138733567717180942009-06-05T12:14:19.792-04:002009-06-05T12:14:19.792-04:00I suspect (hope) that the LPC are hoping for an el...I suspect (hope) that the LPC are hoping for an election and a change in government before this thing becomes law - either that or they will not stand in the way of a constitutional challenge if it does become law.<br /><br />Though I must say it is times like these that I really wish that coalition had happened.Gaylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08112657859825911939noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-55425401235690462872009-06-05T12:12:15.838-04:002009-06-05T12:12:15.838-04:00If that;s the case then Steve I still see no reaso...If that;s the case then Steve I still see no reason to support this bill. What about the lives of all the people who will end up going to prison? And not just them but spouses & children? Have you thought about that? It's a huge mistake to support this bill & allow it to pass.penlanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07830912393649649485noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-88236953271802817792009-06-05T12:09:19.909-04:002009-06-05T12:09:19.909-04:00"So I reject your suggestion that this is jus..."So I reject your suggestion that this is just a reoccurence of something we've seen before."<br /><br />If you want to argue degree, I agree completely. My point, I wasn't particularly taken aback by our stance here, given our past behavior. It's a pretty clear pattern, and it's no coincidence why the Cons love to push on this file.Steve Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04871113039374739208noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20358187.post-53657490590544041352009-06-05T12:06:20.684-04:002009-06-05T12:06:20.684-04:00I think we're in new territory here. Yes ther...I think we're in new territory here. Yes there have been objectionable, and unscientific provisions in past crime bills but this latest one is particularly reprehensible give. Of all the crime "initiatives" the Conservatives have brough forward over the years this one will have the most reprecussions, and consequently is the one on which the "Liberals" should take a stand. <br /><br />So I reject your suggestion that this is just a reoccurence of something we've seen before.KChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16932623568330893522noreply@blogger.com