Wednesday, April 07, 2010

What Happened To All The Noise?

Below, the federal NDP rally against Nova Scotia's HST hike:

Back in the day:

Truth hurts.


Eugene Forsey Liberal said...


Sir Gallahad said...


Thy name is NDP.

Self righteous hypocrites, the whole damn bunch of them.

Steve V said...

It's a very regressive tax you know.

Tof KW said...

Reminds me of how back in the day Ont premier Bill Davis used to call Ed Broadbent - 'Broadbluff' - because the NDP could say anything they wanted knowing they'd never be elected to power (federally) and have to deliver.

Shame too because regardless of my thoughts on the NDP I've always respected Mr. Broadbent ...I can't say the same for old 'snakeoil' Layton.

Steve V said...

What's particularly curious, the way the federal NDP put a bear hug on Dexter, like he was some savior, and he's NEVER been in line with them ideologically. Just like Doer and Calvert before him, you see the chasm between the theoretical federal NDP and the practical application. And, no amount of rationalization will ever change the facts at hand.

Anthony said...

hahaha, this is hilarious

Robert said...

Wait so you want the NDP in NS to end the HST that the Liberals brought in 15 years ago? Is that what you want then raise the PST to the same levels the LIBERALS in PEI have it at? Or the LIBERALS in Quebec plan to raise it too over the next two years? No oh ok this is one of those silly arguments that makes no sense gotcha.

Steve V said...


Josh said...

Once again, you seem to be implying that the HST is somehow new to NS, rather than being a product of the Savage Liberal government in the 90s. And this egregious increase is surely without precedent in history, even if it does nothing more than reverse Harper's GST cuts, a policy you have previously described as "spot on". Attempting to liken this to the introduction of a new HST is so much hot air, particularly in light of low income refundable tax credits. Or does this stuff interfere with your nuanced "federal NDP is bad/hypocritical" meme?

Steve V said...

Just to keep the facts clear:

"Prince Edward Island has a 10 per cent sales tax and the five per cent federal GST, but those levies apply to a narrower range of items than in Nova Scotia."

Steve V said...

"Or does this stuff interfere with your nuanced "federal NDP is bad/hypocritical" meme?"

Nuanced, the shit writes itself? Hey look, I know the drill, you guys defend everything, the NDP is never wrong, whatever.

So, will there be a anti-HST rally in Nova Scotia or not? Highest in the country, I mean it's a symbol for all that's wrong with repressive taxation that unfairly hurts the less fortunate. Isn't that the line?

Steve V said...

Oh, and the NDP isn't bad, they're just like everyone else. That's the point, Mount Pure is a molehill.

JimmE said...

I'M a small business person in Ontario. The HST will save me time, effort & money. I stopped buying & selling things to concentrate on services 6 years ago as a direct result of the PST. I'm in the planning stages of going back to having products made so I can sell them; because of the HST.
The result of the HST coming to Ontario (in my case) as long as I achieve my goals:

-I will increase my sales/cash flow & (I hope) my profitability
- At least three local manufactures will see an increase due to my purchases
- Next year I will take on new staff

Yes, clients who now use my services will see an increase in their costs, but as 80% are businesses & this increase will be reduced from their HST - so the HST is a wash.

Perhaps I'm the only one in this position, but even if a couple of hundred other small guys like me are in the same boat, hiring folks, spending more money,& pay more taxes, that can only be a positive.

So you folks who all PO's about the HST - go suck a lemon!

DL said...

Dexter didn't bring in the HST. It was already there - so nothing could be done about it. You cannot put toothpaste back into a toothpaste tube. Essentially, the NS government simply took the 2% that the Tories cut from the GST and took it for Nova Scotia - good for them! I'm sure Dexter will make better use of the money than Harper would.

Once upon a time, the federal Liberals ranted and raved about the evils of the GST and the evils of a Free Trade agreement with the US. Whatever happened to that???

There is probably no way to stop the HST from coming to Ontario and BC - but voters can still punish the goons who brought it in - the alliance of federal Tories and provincial Liberals! Quite frankly, if you live in BC or Ontario - what happens in provincial politics in Nova Scotia is irrelevant. The Liberal government of Quebec is bringing in a flat user fee for doctors visits and Ignatieff thinks that's just a great idea! I wonder how many people in Manitoba will reject the federal Liberals because they don't like what the provincial Liberals are doing in Quebec??

Steve V said...

Swing, and a miss.

Sir Gallahad said...

Of course Dexter takes no responsibility for his decision.

None what so ever.

The previous government made him do it.

I kinda am glad the NDP, got their sorry asses in power in Nova Scotia.

The people there will get a belly full of it. The act will wear thin REAL FAST.

It is also a good eye opener for the rest of Atlantic Canada, who might have had thoughts of flirting with the NDP.

It is only going to get worse in Nova Scotia, so enjoy the mistake you made.

If tory times are tough times, NDP times are even worse.

DL said...

So far "Grit times" seem to be worst of all if you look at the the most rock bottom unpopular premiers in the country - Charest, Campbell and the lowliest of them all Shawn Graham!

Sir Gallahad said...

Soon to be joined by Darrell Dexter.

(It is not Graham's, Mcguinty's, or Charest's fault, it is all the fault of the previous government)

Josh said...

Yep, Gallahad, reversing previous value-added tax cuts and rejigging income tax brackets will no doubt by the End of Nova Scotia for all time. The rhetoric surrounding this rather pedestrian budget is some of the more ridiculously inflammatory and over-the-top that I've seen. At least the NS deficit is around a quarter proportionally of Ontario's.

Sir Gallahad said...

Well lookee here, the NDP cavalry has ridden in to the rescue.

We now have two swings, and two misses.

Sir Gallahad said...

"Stop HST" "Join NDP"

A picture truly is worth a thousand words.

I guess Dexter has under cut Jack.
How can he run around Canada, pontificating against the HST, without reminding people of that darn varmint Dexter.

The NDP is always preaching sermons from the mount. They are the only ones who care. Everybody else is evil.

This looks just fine on the NDP.

According to Josh, people are just thrilled with this increase in the HST.

Well Josh, do you think Dexter is ready to take that to the people?

He would have his sorry ass handed to him on a plate, and you know it.

I am only sorry people in NS have to wait another 3 years, to give him the boot.

Strike 3 and you are out.

Marpman said...

I think a single-tax system is inevitable in all provinces. What we should fight for is the elimination of all taxes on core items such as food and things such as bicycles.
The Tories love it as it hides the GST.

Josh said...

According to Josh, people are just thrilled with this increase in the HST.

I don't think anyone is thrilled by it. I'm not clear what a workable alternative is in light of the fiscal situation. Care to name one? Plus I thought that the federal Liberals agreed at least in principle that Harper's GST cuts were a mistake. Or is that wrong? Not "spot on" policy, I guess, whatever Gerard Kennedy might say?

Well Josh, do you think Dexter is ready to take that to the people?

He would have his sorry ass handed to him on a plate, and you know it.

Perhaps. Only a few years ago the NS Liberals under Danny Graham actually proposed tax increases during an election. They certainly didn't win, but the Hamm government would soon afterward reverse previous tax cuts.

Where are the Liberals' calls for tough choices and - yes - tax increases? They seemed to warm to the GST while in office, and I don't recall that harming Chretien in the long run. McGuinty won re-election after introducing health care premiums and Campbell won another majority despite the carbon tax. I'm not sure Layton has been right to "take on" the HST in Ontario and BC, but then I don't think Carole James was right to oppose the carbon tax either. But that is what opposition parties tend to do - oppose. Does Stephen McNeil oppose the HST increase? What would he actually do differently is he were in the premier's chair?

Omar said...

"I am only sorry people in NS have to wait another 3 years, to give him the boot."

I absolutely guarantee that will not happen. The two traditional parties are currently mired in the political wilderness and that situation will not change significantly in 36 months. Dexter is here for at least two mandates. Put money on it.

Sir Gallahad said...


Look, the problem I have with the NDP, is the self righteous tone they take.

They are always preaching about their ethics, and morals.

They alsways say they are the only ones who care.

Layton, even accused Martin a few elections ago, about not caring about homeless people. He was shown holding his head and crying, after he made that statement.

The NDP, is always preaching sermons from the mount.

That is my problem with them.

Well they do not breathe rarified air, and are just like everybody else.

DL said...

YOu're projecting your stereotype of the NDP. Quite frankly, we have not preached "sermons from the mount" in many many years. in fact what drives the Liberals to distraction is that the NDP is shedding the old Marquess of Queensberry rule book and is now prepared to play hardball and is not making any apologies for wanting to win elections and win power. Liberals don't like it because in election after election since 2000, NDP support keeps going up and Liberal support keeps going down. Its just a matter of time before the NDP train passes the Liberal train and as Nikita said to Richard Nixon - we will wave to to you from the window saying "Dasvidania, Dasvidania"

Steve V said...

I'm just fascinated by the disconnect between the theoretical federal NDP and their practical provincial applications. It's the way the federal NDP dry humped Darrel Dexter, when he actually represented a philosophical departure. Nobody bothered to notice beyond the similar orange shade, but really the pride of federal NDP supporters was always a sham. I actually could make a case that McGuinty is to the left of Dexter, same with some other past provincial "lions", particularly the socialist Harper gave the gig to.

Sir Gallahad said...


Dream on my friend.

You guys have not even formed an official opposition, in all your years of existence.


Your party will never form the government, and they will never even be an official opposition.

Keep screaming from the bleachers.

Keep protesting everything.

The only things the NDP do well are to protest, complain, portray themselves as victims, and act irrational.

Robert said...

I get it Steve is mad because Iggy went to NS and it didn`t change a thing. He spent a bunch of days down there and the NDP still won a majority.

Keep attacking the NDP Steve you are only 3 points behind the Cons. That is the Liberals for you eyes off the prize and snatching defeat from victory.

DL said...

The federal NDP would be every bit as "practical" in power. We saw just last year that the NDP was willing to put a lot of water in its wine in order rid Canada of Stephen Harper - but the Liberals decided they would rather have the Tories stay in power indefinitely. I think of the reasons Liberals are scarred shitless about NDP cabinet ministers is that they know that in power, NDPers would be very pragmatic and practical and the old taboos against voting NDP would melt away rapidly. The Liberal fear is not that the NDP will be too radical and impractical. The Liberal fear is that the NDP will be very effective and moderate and will make all of Canada look like Manitoba (i.e. NDP in power, Tories in opposition, Liberals reduced to one vestigial seat where all the upper class twits of Winnipeg live)

I suspect that if the NDP continues to grow and becomes a contender for power at the national level - it will become very much like a Canadian version of the Australian Labor Party. In many ways it wouldn't be THAT different from the old Liberal Party of Canada - just minus all the negative baggage the Liberals have accumulated over the years, with a bit more of a populist and western tinge and a bit more of an appeal to the Hillary Clinton-type "white working class" voters and some vestigial links to organized labour.

Sir Gallahad said...


When push came to shove and Jack knew that the Liberals were not voting confidence in Steve.

What did Jack do?

He is always secure in the knowledge, that he can be as irresponsible as he wants.

He can promise anything he wants, because he will never be asked to fulfill those promises.

You guys are the ones who feel it is more important to attack Liberals, than the Conservatives.

You do it all the time.

When you get right down to the brass tacks, you guys are responsible for Harper ever being PM, in the first place.

Jack just felt he had to exert himself and vote no confidence in Martin.

DL, a lot of good things died when that happened.

Child care, and Kelowna to name a few.

And what exactly did you gain?

A few extra seats, that is all. You are still the fourth party, who almost no one takes seriously.

DL said...

Last winter, the NDP help out a hand to the Liberals and offered to make Michael Ignatieff Prime Minister of Canada. But Iggy decided that unless he could have every single marble, he didn't want the job and so a year and a half later Harper is still PM - and its ALL IGNATIEFF'S FAULT. He had a choice. He could have said YES. He could have voted down the Tory budget in January '09, been sworn in as PM a week later and right now the Liberals and to a lesser extent the NDP would be getting all the credit for rescuing Canada from the economic crisis Harper was leading us into. But dumb Iggy pissed it all away and blew his chance.

Harper is PM for two reasons 1) The Liberals were totally corrupts and Paul Martin didn't know ho to campaign and 2) Ignatieff refused to drive Harper out of power when he had the chance.

Stephen Harper - the house Paul Martin and Iggy built...brick by brick.

Sir Gallahad said...


That is bullshit.

That is a straw man argument.

The reason we have Harper, is because of the NDP.

If the Liberals are so corrupt, and so evil why did you want to have a coalition, and make Ignatieff PM?

Ignatieff knew that particular arrangement was not acceptable to the Canadian public.

The thought of Layton as finance minister, probably alomost drove a lot of Canadians to suicide.

You guys are 100% responsible for Harper.

Come next election I will predict that the NDP. attacks the Liberals, and helps out their buddy Steve.

You guys killed Kelowna, and child care.

You thought it was more important to gain a handful of seats, than to deliver those two particular programs to Canadians.

I hope Canadians wake up to the fact that the NDP, is a waste of time, they can never deliver anything, and they are useless.

Stephen Harper, the house Jack, and Olivia built brick by brick.

Sir Gallahad said...

Of course there is no guarantee that the GG, would have turned to the opposition, and invited them to form a government.

She acquiesced to Steves, demand to prorogue parliament.

So we will never know, if the government was defeated what would have happened.

My guess is that if she hadn't turned to the opposition, and invited them to form a government we would have had an election.

With anti coalition emotions running high, we would have had that Harper majority.

That also would have been the fault of the NDP.

That is why the NDP, is so bitter.

A coalition was their only chance to get into the corriders of power.

They can't get anywhere near close to power on their own.

So what party really is desperate. Certainly not the Liberals.

The NDP, is fearful of being squeezed out, is Canadians decide to turf Harper.

They will vote Liberal to do that just like they did in 93.

marie said...

So far "Grit times" seem to be worst of all if you look at the the most rock bottom unpopular premiers in the country - Charest, Campbell and the lowliest of them all Shawn Graham

I live in BC and Campbell came in and brought the province back from nothing and business came to the province and then the province prospored after a 10 year run of NDP. Maybe Campbell isn't as popular as he was at the begining but in my province, Carole James is not an option and I will still give my vote to the enemy I know, not a NDP who will promise the moon ruin the economy brag about their balanced budget only to find it a few million short of what they really had in the books and the liberals coming in to pay off the debts. Kind of reminds me of Molroney and the conservatives in debt and having the liberals come in and balance the books and pay off the debts. 2010, the Reformatories raising the debt and out of control and waiting for someone to come in and clean up their mess.

If anyone can remember, 2009 was the year BC was burning costing millions over firefighting and enough firemen from other provinces and even othe countries to help control the fires and save hundreds if not millions of homes in the province.That had to have cost a bundle which didn't help the lIberal budget much all the time having Carole James bad mouthing them for having a deficit they helped to create .

It doesn't take a licenced economist to know that a huge part of the liberals deficit as well as the Olympics added to the deficit.

Steve V said...

Pointing to the blue sky isn't an "attack" you silly hack.